(Image: The Jilted Siren)
A Capitol Hill lounge is closing in what small business advocates say could be the start of a year of shutdowns for Seattle’s restaurants, bars, and small businesses most impacted by the 2025 expiration of the city’s tip credit.
The Jilted Siren announced headed into the holidays they were shutting down the Bellevue Ave location and considering a possible reopening in a more affordable location.
Their last night of business came over the weekend. How the city’s food and drink industry is faring, The Jilted Siren’s ownership says, will be part of the decision on whether — and where — to reopen.
“We will see what shakes out w all the changes coming in January. Seattle City council made some pretty short sighted, negligent decisions and there are going to be quite a few casualties from it,” the lounge posted on social media.
The closure comes as the credit for tips and benefits for companies with fewer than 500 employees is set to expire. Industry advocates have said wages could jump nearly $3 an hour for some small restaurants and bars.
Laying the decision at the feet of the Seattle City Council isn’t entirely fair. This summer, District 3 representative Joy Hollingsworth began a push for an extension of the tip credit put in place ten years ago to protect the city’s small businesses during Seattle’s phase-in of a higher minimum wage tied to inflation.
Hollingsworth’s proposal would have created a permanent credit by lowering the amount at which inflation would increase wages for small businesses.
The proposal faced intense criticism from labor and worker groups including former District 3 leader Kshama Sawant who rallied against the permanent credit. Behind the scenes, city officials were also backing off.
In October, Mayor Bruce Harrell announced his office’s intent to let the credit expire saying it was “the right thing for wage fairness.”
The mayor’s office said more could be done to help the small businesses and especially restaurants and bars most impacted by the tip credit change.
“I will be continuing our conversations with small businesses to identify tangible and actionable ways we can help make Seattle more affordable,” Harrell said in October, including “public safety to inflation, insurance, and a wide array of other cost pressures, including best practices in addressing the absence of a tip credit.”
The Jilted Siren’s closure comes after about a year and a half of business for the bar and restaurant. CHS reported here on the October 2023 opening of the new bar inspired by love and loss from industry veteran and first-time owner Amy Graham in the former home of Kedai Makan.
Now, a year and seven months later, Graham and her crew are saying goodbye.
“Thank you for your loyalty and support,” Graham wrote. “Running a small business in Seattle is crazy hard, and each day you all made it worth it.”
While the may may not work out for Graham and The Jilted Siren, others are moving forward.
As The Jilted Siren sorts out what is next, 1802 Bellevue Ave won’t be empty. Graham says a new restaurant tenant is lined up for the space.
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Lived in the neighborhood for their entire run and never hear a word about them from neighbors, friends or coworkers…
I personally feel the business would have had a better vibe if workers got paid less…much less. That’s usually what makes a good business atmosphere, in my experience. Cherry Street coffee used to be great until the wokes started bringing up “labor rights” pshhh
Sounds like someone is hoping for some responses. So, here’s one to start things up.
what even is this comment? a better vibe if workers get paid less..? are you a terminator or something?
everyone know that the less someone gets paid the harder they work.
“are you a terminator or something?”
That’s spectacular…lol
😂 100. I guess some people dont understand sarcasm anymore. But yes rights or privileges of any kind should not be tolerated! Anti-appreciation is still appreciation just be happy you get to work for such amazing customers👨
Travel up to Vancouver or to college cities around the US.
Restaurant staff are paid WAY less yet they show up and work, and are pleasant if you are a patron.
It’s not the wages perse, perhaps its why go work all day when you can live on the streets for free with impunity and/or you’re never going to make celebrity/influencer money.
Seattle is in a bad spot, y’all. We can’t have 90% of the city as either super rich or super poor.
nice sarcasm
I continue to be baffled by the notion that small businesses have a right to short change workers.
I continue to be baffled that people pretend this is about short-changing anyone. The tip exception is there (for one more day) BECAUSE WORKERS MAKE THAT MONEY IN TIPS. It isn’t short-changing – removing the exemption means workers get a double dip. Also, quit fucking pretending the benefits won’t be wiped out by an increase in the most often purchased items by the working class – food, gas, beer, etc … So small biz owners eat shit and no wealth inequality really gets addressed.
So make the tip exception for all restaurants or all workers? Why should it only apply to small businesses?
I’m not necessarily opposed to opening it up, but it hurts small businesses disproportionately, seeing as how there isn’t as much profit below the bottom line. Ultimately, most tipped workers make at least $10/hour in tips (many as much at $45-50/hr after wage is considered), so it’s laughable that they aren’t making a living wage. Forcing biz owners to pay this hefty sum when bartenders are doing just fine is wild.
How does it hurt small businesses disproportionately? Large businesses have had to pay the higher wage for years. That seems disproportionate, no?
I agree with you that restaurant workers make plenty and don’t need the additional wage, but not giving it to them is definitely enforcing a lower wage for workers that work for small businesses vs those that do the same job for large businesses, no?
Not sure what the point is – yes, they would make less at a small business. Every job carries with it different tangible and intangible benefits for a worker.
As far as the proportionality, the average small business does in sales, has fewer owners, and operates less efficiently than a large business. This means that an owner is far more vulnerable to things like an overnight bloat to an expense category. The effect is greater, and is applied to fewer people.
Then just say “we want to subsidize less efficient businesses and need a handout from the city” rather than “we need to exploit workers because we’re small”.
“This means that an owner is far more vulnerable to things like an overnight bloat to an expense category.”
It’s a good thing this has been comin’ down the road for a decade. Otherwise it’d be a hardship surprise.
But because you’ve had a decade to prepare, you are good to go right?
that’s some made up stuff there…$40-$50 an hour…Where’s that place?
“Small business” is 500 or fewer employees. AKA: The city councils businesses. These people do not care how labor lives. It is ALL about them.
really? So because we have a system that makes labor depend on charity for their work. As opposed to an hourly wage or salary they get “double tips” now? Is that how you add that up?
“Small business owners” are some of the whiniest around. What is it? The fact you think labor isn’t worth being paid more? That’s it isn’t it? You are superior to them therefore they deserve less.
If you weren’t such a snarky ass, I’d spend more time on it, but my guess is that even if I showed you the books, you’d still just call names and flip me off. For your info, you indolent prick, my bartenders will make $82k this year on the new minimum wage if they choose to work full time. We are a neighborhood bar and we pool tips and our kitchen gets an equitable tipout before this. I make less than them much of the time, so pardon me, but you have no clue what you’re talking about. You just bark and bark and shout people down without considering their reality. My employees make a pretty great wage “depending on charity” as you put it. They also enjoy working for tips. If we are going to define a livable wage and not account for the tips they earn, then yes, we are unfairly charging business owners for an unnecessary. Go back to your angry cave, troll.
Then we should look at a tip credit for all businesses and/or a lowering of the minimum wage, no?
You are ONE business.
As for the rest? Whatever.
“double tips”
“If you weren’t such a snarky ass”
Look in the mirror. Ignore me.
I am not a troll. Facts are facts.
“I continue to be baffled that people pretend this is about short-changing anyone. The tip exception is there (for one more day) BECAUSE WORKERS MAKE THAT MONEY IN TIPS. It isn’t short-changing – removing the exemption means workers get a double dip”
I failed remedial math…X2. That is a real fact. But I can do this math.
Raising wages equals more money AND tips is also, more money. It’s cash in hand. Like YOU get regardless of good or bad business. Everyone else depends on charity forever? 50 years flat wages is just fine?
Getting a pay raise is “double dipping”???
OMG! THAT is a doozy. Do you really believe that or are you just saying stuff?
More money is more money. If it’s so cushy? GET A JOB! Or compete on a LEVEL playing field. Not always with hat in hand hiding a gun for a stick up everytime someone gets a raise. Also? You were NEVER EVER EVER giving ANYONE A RAISE EVARRRR! So the only way to tame the greed is to raise wages to a wage that provides enough to get of welfare etc.
What are you talking about? Not that you actually care, but I’ve giving high performing employees raises they never asked for many times, given profit shares, given free PTO, health care stipends they never asked for … you are just an angry, presumptuous, ranting old fool.
The owner responded to clarify that they aren’t blaming the closure on the minimum wage change, which they supported (but had issues with how it was done), it’s already-astronomical commercial rent prices rising w/ no safety net for small business owners.
That’s correct. And also, Revenue-Expenses=Profit. Both rent and wages contribute to expenses. The owner clarified that the building had been sold out from under them, so it had as much to do with rent as the minimum wage.
But the existing lease does not go away when the building is sold. Most new restaurants sign multi year leases. The new owner purchases the building with the existing leases and cannot just impose new terms on existing leases. So why would the building sale result in unexpected rent increases? I don’t think they did. I think the business owners were not making as much revenue as they hoped, and the minimum wage increase was the deciding factor. The new landlord was not willing to work with them (lower rent) so they decided to close.
Why don’t you ask them, Glenn? A lease is a legally enforceable document. Either there is grounds for what happened in there or they can sue for damages. I suspect the former. A G?
“Why don’t you ask them, Glenn?”
her we are again with you. A legit issue is brought up. You CAN answer it. Instead? A worthless remark that does not educate. It is meant to END a conversation. Thus enabling the losing side to avoid going deeper into a hole.
You are welcome to dismiss and name call. But don’t be some self righteous Godzilla marching thru Tokyo.
Are you actually a Russian bot? Sure seems that way.
The girl (girls) said in this comment section it was not the raise in wages. Yet, here you are.
*women* (presuming you know their gender identity)
sad as hell. a welcoming, chill place with good food and fun things going on. rising rents and expenses are burying small businesses left and right.
Aw. I liked this place. If I lived closer to it I would have been there all the time.
But the way to help out struggling bars and restaurants isn’t on wages. From what I hear, retail rents are ludicrously high these days. Chipping into that somehow would make a bigger difference, without asking people to work for less than it costs to live here.
Unfortunately, the cost of labor for a small business dwarfs rent. My rent is market rate and the cost of labor for us is about 3 times rent.
Don’t bother talking any facts here. It will just get in the way of the political agenda. It’s greedy landlords! It’s all because of cars! Tear down every gas station! The police are the problem! And on the progressive merry go round goes.
Yeah. Really. Well, people are gonna have to find somewhere other than a local bar/restaurant to hash out these narratives because they won’t exist anymore … oh right … it’s all done in the comment sections.
Explain why wages are flat for 50 years?
I am serious.
OK Kshama. Wages have not been flat against inflation. Stop the drivel.
“Ignored is the easy-to-understand root of rising income inequality, slow living-standards growth, and a host of other key economic challenges: the near stagnation of hourly wage growth for the vast majority of American workers over the past generation.”
“The U.S. middle class had $17,867 less income in 2007 because of the growth of inequality since 1979Household income of the broad middle class, actual and projected assuming no growth in inequality, 1979–2011″
There’s more but you go ahead and show me how wages rose over that time? Don’t name call princess. Let’s argue instead?
https://www.epi.org/publication/charting-wage-stagnation/
No prob – First of all, the article you reference is the first one to pop up when you Google “wage stagnation”. I’m gonna go ahead and guess that’s how you found it. You haven’t actually done a deep dive into the facts. You Googled the result you wanted, and found an article by a seemingly credible source corroborating Kshama’s points, so you posted it with a smug smile. Second, these numbers reference US wage averages. About a quarter of the states use the federal minimum wage of $7.25/hr. This deeply skews the reality in Seattle, where the new minimum wage is pushing 3x higher. Third, what we have been honking about on this jackass comment section is the exemption for tips. In other words, we have done research to determine a livable, bare bones minimum wage in Seattle and determined it to be $20.76/hr in 2025. You can disagree all you want, but these numbers include health insurance and market rate rent. It follows the CPI, which erases the effects of inflation. The point is, the minimum wage creates a safety net that prevents poverty, as it should. To ignore the fact that workers are making tips (the basis for my argument that it is double-dipping) while charging employers to add to their income is deeply unfair to employers. If you have a problem with the calculation, go whine to L&I. Don’t piss and moan about greedy employers and threaten politicians. This is a fact-based number and it is wrong to ignore the fact that removing the tip exemption penalizes struggling employers while padding the pockets of your average downtown bartender. You can hate it all you want, but you admitted that your only motivation is “more money”. To be clear, I’m not pretending we don’t have wealth inequality. We have a terrible wealth inequality problem, but it has little to do with small business owners, who usually make marginally more than workers. I’m calling for continuity, recognizing that we’ve determined a baseline, so let’s apply the baseline to all wages, not ignoring tips. And don’t call it charity – employers are required to account for average tipouts of each employee, the vast majority of people making WAY more than the $3 of the exemption. Lastly, don’t try and shift your tack now. All you do on this shit forum is call names. To pretend to give a shit about fact and debate at this stage is disingenuous at best. You are a troll. A trolly, trolly princess troll.
Aww shiiit.. We loved this place. Everyone was so nice, food was great and appreciated all the fun events. They put alot of heart into it and it showed.
Long time reader, first time poster. An equally large problem is the sheer amount of new business’s that we’ve never even heard of. They open, they close, more open, more close. Any business that believes they will be flush within the first year or two of opening, is not realistic about their business making money. Typically, at least a 3 year window is needed for profitability (60% fail within 1 year, 80% fail within 5 years).
I live less than 8 blocks from this and I honestly didn’t even know it was there. There are so many places in the Seattle area, and most of them are one and done and frankly not very good. Or they are similar (or often almost identical) in concept to what’s already around.
I go out about once a week, and I choose to frequent the tried and true because I’ve been burned way too many times with mediocre food and equally mediocre service.
If you never try new places, it’s not surprising you never heard of this; obviously you’re not keeping an eye out. It was profiled here several times, always had sidewalk signs out, etc. I loved the Jilted Siren; the bartenders knew how to make good drinks, on and off menu, the food was fantastic, and the vibe was nice and cozy.
Commercial real estate prices in this city are out of control and I hate that we’re blaming the working class instead of the true problem. Look up how much it costs to rent a cafe space in Seattle vs Rome or Paris or London, and wonder why casual dining is so much more expensive here, despite those cities paying their labor force a working wage.
Talk to the tech industry.
It’s not the customers job to find new places… it’s the new places job to find customers.
Good point. Seattle overly restricts commercial because residents like to live in a city yet demand it stay a single family “suburb.”
Go look up what minimum wage is in Rome. (Hint — there is no minimum wage in Italy). The average low-skills job pays around EUR1200/mo, and the median income is around EUR2500/mo.
https://www.eurofound.europa.eu/en/resources/article/2023/minimum-wage-debate-italy
That is not entirely correct. There is no state mandated minimum wage, but literally seconds of googling reveals that most Italian workers are covered by collective bargaining agreements, a wildly different scenario than in the United States.
There are zero Italian unions and collective bargaining agreements associated with any employees at small cafes and restaurants in Italy.
I love that you use your reference from Google but I’ve actually done business there.
Good for you? You made a broad, sweeping statement about what “low-skills” jobs pay there, the lack of a minimum wage, and treated it as if it were an apples-to-apples situation about why a “cafe experience” is cheaper there.
It is not, because the Italian labor market operates under very different conditions than that in the US. There’s a bunch of other ways that there are important differences as well, cost of housing, cost of food, etc. that are all driven by overall economic policy and cultural priorities.
(this also applies to the comment you were responding to, but they are explicitly pointing to the fact that we could be making different regulatory choices).
You could use your extensive business experience in Italy to provide a break down of overall fixed and variables costs for running a cafe over there and compare them to cost breakdown of the same business in US and then point the reader to some ideas about WHY those costs are different or similar.
As noted by the owners below, the costs of labor were not actually the deciding factor, regardless of people’s assumptions.
So, a breakdown of the cost structure of doing business in seattle vs rome would surely be very informative for all the readers here.
I don’t think they care. They seem pretty wrapped up in themselves.
This is a good and subtle point, where there has been a shit ton of changes in the past 2 years on top of completely different consumer engagement since 2020 (on my side at least).
100%, for better or worse, the pandemic changed everything. I used to go out 2-3 times a week for drinks and food. I was much more forgiving of service and an occasional subpar meal. My priorities changed, if I’m going out now it’s intentional and with people I truly want to be with and to places I really want to go to and know I will have a great experience at. It’s called brand loyalty and builds longevity for local businesses. I’m not saying I’ll never try anything new, I did just last week, and it was fantastic. But when an average bill for 2 people approached $150-$175, well, I’m extremely cautious about trying new places. Went to a Thai place a few weeks ago and the bill was over $80 for two people plus tip. One cocktail and main for each person and an appetizer to share. Service was apathetic at best. That bill was hard to stomach.
We are still feeling covid too. Back to work is starting again. These business owners know this. So they are gas to the floor to scrape back ANY progressive revenue the people voted for. They simply steal it now after fighting against it. Then stole it. Then bragged about all the good stuff we are doing with the slush fund. Not housing or green new deal. Ghost cops, not infrastructure.
I am poor. Nothing makes me more disappointed than a $17 BLT with bacon that’s sat on the grill since 6AM and it’s 2PM. I went on vacation to Florida and didn’t have a decent meal. It was all crap that was overpriced. I Ate at McDonalds and Waffle House. The rest sucked.
Blaming others for mismanagement is common.
Phooey! Went a few times and the food was always good, drinks always delightful, but never got to play Bingo. Yeah…I wanted to play Bingo at least once while having their smash burger. Ah well, appreciate the experiences.
It is really sad that Seattle’s bad public policy (previous council) and cowardice to stand up to labor unions and special interest groups (current council) is forcing small businesses to close. A tip exemption for the minimum wage is reasonable when tips are ~20% of the bill. Raising labor costs will obviously raise prices, lead to reduced staffing, lead to reduced opening hours, and force closures when the margins are already so thin. It is also likely to reduce tipping. Are workers better off as a result or is this another example of progressive overreach making things worse?
I overheard someone say they were going to be making more per hour but expected less tips and now they have to also pay these prices when they go to businesses and restaurants so it sound like a bunch of smoke and mirrors.
Look at the cost of rent before you blame the people working to serve your sorry ass.
I’m going to join the chorus of people pointing the finger at rising rents more than wages being the issue on Capitol Hill. Commercial rents have been spiking out of reach for a lot of independent businesses.
AGREED
Yes, commercial rents are too high. I would support some form of commercial rent control because corporate landlords aren’t acting in good faith, but the “living wage” activists that don’t allow for a tip credit are also the problem. Seattle’s minimum wage is $6/hr higher than NYC and in NYC tips count toward the minimum wage requirement. While Seattle’s minimum wage legislation is well intended, it is way out of balance. Without a tip credit, the minimum wage for servers is far higher than minimum wages outside the service industry. This makes no sense and it has major implications for the viability of small businesses in the service industry. We have been squeezing out small local businesses for years and this is the final straw. All that we will have left are chains and over-priced bars and restaurants with limited hours that are only for the rich and special occasions. This does not make for a vibrant city.
Not all landlords are corporate, in fact most are not. In fact, Laura Miller is responsible for more commercial real estate in this town than just about anybody. While I hate how expensive real estate is, it is also set by what the market will bare. It’s tough to blame someone for buying a building with a bank loan as an investment and renting it to make money/cover the cost of the loan. Be mad that the tech industry has devalued the dollar in Seattle, but don’t hate the individual that rents for market rate.
“I would support some form of commercial rent control because corporate landlords aren’t acting in good faith, but the “living wage” activists that don’t allow for a tip credit are also the problem.”
I’m going to disagree. The “problem” is business owners expect others to pay their wages. If they don’t make much? Food stamps. We all pay again. The “problem” is labor works for charity vs. owners getting hard cash.
But you do you.
But what are small business owners supposed to do about that? The city keeps making it the responsibility of small business owners to increase wages while doing nothing to address the rising rent increases.
It’s not that most small business owners want to stiff their workers, it’s that they literally can’t afford to stay in business because of the exorbitant cost the city keeps expecting them to pay. It’s no coincidence that the cute small businesses are shutting down all over the hill and being replaced by soulless franchises run by rich bros.
Progressives in this city seem to want all businesses to be run by rich people rather than the working class artists who actually live here. Or I should say, used to live here. When rents were affordable back in the 90s, this neighborhood was amazing and the businesses were owned by the artists and musicians who contributed to the culture. Progressives can yell “pay your workers” all they want, but it does nothing to address the reality business owners actually face and frankly makes them sound like clueless college kids whose parents still support them and have no idea what it takes to run a business in the city.
The problem I see with your assertion that progressives only say “pay your workers” and “want all businesses to be run by rich people” while they ignore rising rents…is that progressives are not currently in power lol. Also, progressive as a moniker largely means nothing nowadays, and is mainly used to obscure business politics as vaguely left due to it not well-defined in public discourse outside of the concept of FDR’s legacy. Not a very helpful term imo. Kshama Sawant was the leftist pull on the city over the last 10 years and is a Socialist. Socialists are not currently in office either however.
The city (Harrell) refuses to act on rent control because landlords > small business… Landlords largely have more capital on hand to leverage than a small business owner ever could. Small business owners are much more likely to actually have to work for a living, even if well off themselves, whereas landlords literally collect people’s extra income for just owning the bricks around their tenant. No effort exerted, and much time saved. Consequently, it becomes easier to have more time to lobby politicians…commercial landlords get to just chill behind the scenes. Never losing, always gaining.
Please recognize that elected socialists and progressives, or anyone who even considers themselves on the “left” for that matter, must demonstrate that claim through action…any “pro-big-business” agenda is neither left, nor progressive. Harrell is not a progressive, Hollingsworth is not a progressive, and neither have represented even a modicum of the left through their actions.
The left advocates for residential rent control above all because if nothing is done, homeless people will keep appearing after being priced out of the market of homes–and on top of the obvious benefits to business owners with public facing storefronts from less unhoused citizens, business’ employees would massively benefit from stable housing and less money wasted on rent. We have to address residential rent no matter what for the city to not fall into ruin, but there is no reason why the commercial market couldn’t be addressed in tandem, other than pushback from the landlords. Imagine if business owners were enabled to own their own location, too, and not be millions of dollars in debt from the start. It would be a call back to a simpler time when property wasn’t an infinite money glitch, but instead a utilitarian concept for living in or working in. That scenario however would be entirely based on political will…a leftist will that has been propagandized against by the wealthiest in our society (who consequently usually own commercial properties, too.) Capitalism comes for us all!
I gotta be honest – I take issue with the way that you are claiming ownership of what it means to be “left”. Though Sawant is no longer controlling anything directly, she left a stain on this city that has been pretty hard to wipe away. What so I mean? For anyone following her lead, it has become impossible to envision unintended consequences. Everyone that has something that you don’t is an a$$hole and a tyrant. Nobody is “left” that carries a more nuanced opinion. I, for one, am a small business owner, I own my own building, and I charge my own business market rate. I would expect the same from any landlord that is not myself, I have paid this before and been fine with it, and I am also quite bothered by the choice to maintain the removal of the tip exception, an expense that makes little logical sense (and constitutes a massive problem on the books), and has been a hallmark of the self-proclaimed progressive movement. Believe it or not, I consider myself quite progressive, came from the working class, and wore the blue collar for years before starting my business, but have had to relabel my own identity to “practical progressive” to distinguish myself from the othering and short-sidedness of Seattle’s version of “progressive”, an ideology which seems to think Sawant carried the only legitimate torch. An impractical torch. Are we creating some unit of work that is acceptable for a dollar earned? Would you not choose to invest in property if you could? I think you would. What if someone invested every dime they had to buy a building, which would finally get them a path to a good retirement, expecting market rates to achieve this? Are you sure you aren’t just mad because you never had the option to do so? No business enters into a valid lease without a lease agreement, a document that is extremely specific about what happens in any case. You’d be a fool to sign one that wasn’t, and probably shouldn’t be in business if you can’t read a lease or don’t have a lawyer to explain it to you. It is a fool’s errand to blame a landlord for charging market rate, and ignores that not every landlord is shitty and not all of them are “big business”. It’s an expensive city, and as mentioned elsewhere in here, largely due to tech moving here in the early 2000s. Just because you find one prick in a red jacket doesn’t mean all red jackets keep a bad person warm. By the way, if starting your business puts you “millions of dollars in debt”, you probably don’t have a “small” business.
The problem is that it is economically viable to be a landlord in the first place. We need better options for a nest egg and retirement plan than investment in property, because by valuing it so highly as a commodity, stakeholders have an incentive to maintain market shortages–which is why we see an increasing price spiral year over year for a thing that human beings also happen to use as a utility (shelter). Most countries don’t experience that phenomenon, which is why so many non-citizen foreign nationals invest in property here. The government could intervene with price caps, but doesn’t.
That was the crux of my argument–so I’m sorry you took offense to my characterization of the left, but it’s not my fault you feel “left” out lol. You may associate with the left culturally, but if you defend private property as a cornerstone of our society, then you are not economically left. Maybe you are a liberal…liberals are center right economically fyi. Defending a landlord charging “market rate” ignores that the market is completely inflated, and I am acknowledging this as a person who payed way too much for their house (that would be less than half the price on the east coast for its size).
I’m glad you can be a decent guy as you say and charge fair rates yada yada…but I’m not taking issue with you individually, just the system that allows “landlording” and the consequences of the mindset it encourages…because everyone loves to complain about homeless people or business closing due to high rents, but no one wants to address the solution which is increased property market regulation, both residential and commercial.
Good luck with your property investment, but I urge you to consider the downsides of not diversifying your investments. That sounds very privileged, but capitalism isn’t a game to play idly if you’re going to play it. The left hates the position you’ve been forced to put yourself in for retirement, not you. The left believes we can do better as a society for all people so they can live in old age in comfort and dignity…
Your argument suggests you don’t really understand how markets work. You are comparing homes in different cities to determine whether it is “inflated”, a term that can’t actually mean anything objective. Inflated compared to what? The value you determine to be right? That isn’t how it works. It’s worth what people will pay for it. If a landlord can sit on a property longer than you like, maybe the problem is that there are too many ridiculously rich people who can afford to sit on property. Maybe you can start addressing the real issues of wealth inequality and change the WA constitution to allow an income tax? All of the extreme left (what you have been talking about) efforts to inflate the minimum wage and cap prices are hurting the potential for the promise of a healthy economy. Artificial caps are bad for the market (both renters and landlords), and injure people who have spent their money on a strong asset. Please don’t tell me what the left is – it’s patronizing. Don’t urge me to consider a different investment strategy – smells like white privilege.
You should comment on here more if you haven’t seen me address and agree with all your points about state level tax increases. Decommodify housing and increase taxes is what I say. But you also want to avoid capping rent???
Buddy…price controls are everywhere!!! Milk, butter, eggs, gas and electric (in some places), the concept of public schools controls price against private schooling to some extent…price controls in markets are EVERYWHERE!!! And they start at the federal government. The idea that price controls are bad is literally neoliberal economic dogma that led us to our current pitiful economic situation with all this inequality…Reagan used price controls to stop inflation!! A republican!!!
But anyway…price caps should ESPECIALLY be in the housing market…sorry. Your investment isn’t so special that everyone else has to suffer without an affordable home!
I’m being patronizing because you are epitomizing dunning-kruger and I want to snap you out of it.
you talk as if anyone can buy a building.
and you as if you know everything.
How so?
“Though Sawant is no longer controlling anything directly, she left a stain on this city that has been pretty hard to wipe away.”
What specifically?
Nobody is blaming the worker, so quit being defensive and calling names. They are blaming the policy for ignoring basic economic principles. Also, why can’t we look at both rent and min wage policy? It isn’t that one category makes or break a business. Your expenses add up and counter your income to create a profit. Both rent and payroll contribute.
Seems the “I’ll never tip again crowd” and the business owners crying picked upon are taking it out on labor. Either directly or indirectly.
I’ve never once though “Oh, they make too much money so I forgo the tip from now on.”.
So yeah…They kinda are blaming the workers.
Trickle down economics is a grift to transfer wealth to the top from the bottom.
Instead of asking for fish? Get a pole.
So wait…”trickle down economics” is now what we call high minimum wages without loopholes? Weird, didn’t know that it was a far left term now.
“high minimum wages”
The word “minimum” is actually IN the answer. “High minimum wage”?
okay…that’s hysterical. Great point…lol
exactly!!! when small businesses can’t afford to stay open they employ no one. and we all lose the places that make seattle special.
We aren’t reducing tipping, but simply not going out to eat —which has been our solution. Between the pandemic and the rising wages and the labor shortages and the tipping politics, the fun is gone. So we’ve eaten a lot more healthily buying food and cooking it at home. I do not agree with the whole tipping system, but that’s another topic.
This is a joke. The last council are why some of us can even make rent. We need to be paid more as industry workers across the board. Owners get too much of the pie
I will just never get over the idea that if a business doesn’t make enough to pay their workers a living wage it’s just expected that employees get paid less. It’s like people who open businesses feel like they have the right to run it forever. Mind you these are very often the same people who will bad-talk homeless people and poor folks for not working hard enough.
Your comment makes it sound like you think the business has a pile of cash the owners are swimming in like Scrooge McDuck. The business invests X to open and then makes Y income. They have to pay out Z in costs, inclusive of wages to employees and rents plus supplies like food and drinks. If Z goes up, Y is going to go up by raising prices, which could cause fewer people to eat out, which means the business either reduces worker hours / lets go of people or reduces quality of ingredients. Either way the money is coming out from somewhere.
I don’t know a lot of restaurant owners who can just blindly absorb the new costs.
“I don’t know a lot of restaurant owners who can just blindly absorb the new costs.”
Well it’s a good thing this has been on the radar for 10 years! No problemo!
Jilted Siren was fun and I’m sorry to see it close. Its takes so much to just get open. Its ridiculously expensive to open a biz here plus rents are high especially for a city that has spotty foot traffic and poor pedestrian lighting most everywhere. Triple-net is insane here too, especially if the bldg has sold recently and its tax valuation updated. I do think their location is also a bit problematic, the topography is challenging, parking is a bitch. I’ve never seen car share rates going up mentioned as a reason for slower biz but I’ve heard plenty of friends mention it when we’re selecting a spot. Maybe the rise in hourly wages etc is the straw that broke the camel’s back but seems unlikely that alone would topple a healthy establishment. I wish them well and hope they move to the CD which could use them :)
The rise in the minimum wage plus the removal of the tip credit can amount to a 20+% cost increase for labor overnight (tonight). Not many businesses are going to survive this kind of increase without some changes.
And add the astronomical commercial rent here and that’s it for so many businesses.
What is astronomical to you?
Guess what? Not many labor folks are going to survive on charity.
As I read your rants. It really is about you. You can not be that out of touch.
I’ve worked on the corner of Bellevue and Olive for a year now and never even heard of this place before…
We were on the corner of Bellevue and Howell so I’m guessing you didn’t walk down Bellevue towards Denny, but the location is problematic. The corner is tough.
Location isn’t problematic. It had two VERY successful businesses there for years. La Pete and Kedai Makan.
Hey everyone, just wanted to comment here and clarify. We closed because our rent is just way too high. I don’t know if people realize this but there are no protections for commercial renters in Seattle. When we realized we couldn’t stay upright w all the changes coming, we tried to work with our landlords who straight up would not budge. There are no mechanisms in place for tenants to pivot or end a contract unless they are willing to go bankrupt or they are lucky enough to sell, that’s it.
Not once have I mentioned the minimum wage as a reason for the closure, but here’s the thing, do I agree w a wage increase? Yes. Do I agree with how it was done? No. This isn’t going to help anyone as prices will continue to rise. Between the landlords and shortsighted city council, we can expect many, many more closures coming our way soon, and I’d like you all to remember that not one employer is closing to avoid paying their employees! People put their heart, soul and resources into these places, and whether you’re a fan or not, they are a huge sacrifice. Yes , we know it’s risky going in but when your own city is regulating against you, that’s a losing situation for everyone involved.
Amy Graham
THANK YOU.
I worked in a business on the hill and high rent in a shitty building run by a slummy landlord was the main reason for closing. I’ve asked several owners the rent on their spaces and I can only think of one place who has a great deal with a nice landlord, the rest were indecent prices.
This doesn’t even include the triple net costs, either, which always seem criminal.
Rent is the main reason small businesses are unable to pay workers their fair wage and closing.
Mind sharing what it was per sq ft?
Also, wasn’t this in your lease when you signed it – like a year and a half ago? I’m confused.
The building was for sale which they did not disclose.
You signed a lease. A contract. Just because circumstances changed doesn’t mean the landlord should be compelled to modify the lease to your advantage. If your business was more successful than expected would you allow the landlord to modify the lease to their advantage? I doubt it. I am sorry your business closed, and if I were your landlord I would have considered working with you to make things work. But there is no reason the city should facilitate businesses breaking leases when things don’t go their way.
The rent shouldn’t be so egregiously high in the first place, and landlords should be incentivized to keep people in their spaces and not empty.
There actually are in fact compelling economic and social reasons for the council to do just that, but they require a different point of view.
Certainly not in every circumstance, but more regulation of commercial rents could be done in a manner that protected small businesses and provided significantly more social benefits than the extortionate rent/tax write-offs on empty spaces for the massive real estate/private equity firms that own the buildings.
Ah, gotcha. So the new restaurant going in purchased it then?
Thanks for taking the time to provide these details here Amy. With all of the “expert opinions” so many have on stories like this, it’s helpful to know the real reasons, and I hope some of these commenters make it back here to see it. And I’m very sorry for your situation, I did make it there a couple of times and dug the vibes and cocktails, I hope you can find a way to reopen somewhere more accommodating. Sadly this city seems to make opening and operating a small business as difficult as possible, even those leaders who are business owners themselves don’t seem to care much.
Appreciate you commenting. I had to make huge sacrifices to my business, because of huge raises in rent in the building I was located in. Huge raises, in a building with multiple empty spaces. It was the most ludicrous thing I could imagine.
Thank you for sharing more info! Nuance was definitely needed in this discussion–people are hijacking every story about business closure to mean whatever they think it should mean politically, without paying attention to what people are actually saying is happening.
It really does show how little some care for facts and are incentivised to create a narrative that suits them day after day, week after week, year after year. The facts forever changing, yet the narrative is a broken record.
It’s the internet. None of this was a real thing until then. You can be pure as the driven snow or 100% sinister and get about the same amount of attention and respect no matter where you are. Half the voting nation voted for Trump. That’s the only proof ya need.
We are all screwed unless people get a grip on the real. But there’s too much propaganda. And when about 20% of the population is functionally illiterate? This is what you get.
It’s amazing how much an argument is a placeholder for one’s own insecurities, isn’t it? “It really does show how little some care for facts and are incentivised to create a narrative that suits them day after day”
The cooperate conglomerate landlord cretins would rather boot a tenant out and have no rent in their spaces than have fairer pricing cuz that would impact the rest of their slime listings and rent. Heaven forbid! When they say eat the rich, chew on the landlords extra hard.
With the increase in minimum wage, does this mean we do not have to tip anymore? Or at the very least quit feeling obligated to tip the 25% that is set as default on many point-of-sale systems?
I love all the people crapping on tech workers but the starting base salary for an L4 non-engineer role at Amazon is about $75K which equates to ~$36.00 for a 40 hour work week (and they are definitely working more than 40 hours). In Seattle minimum wage will be increased to $20.76 an hour and if you include tips, service workers will be making more than people in tech. Who are you guys going to place all your blame for all your problems?
It is irrefutable that when tech came to Seattle, the value of real estate, a burger, a football game, a beer, all went through the roof, because when silicone valley looked at Seattle, it said, “I can outbid these fools.” IDGAF what an L4 non-engineer role at Amazon is or makes, but I can tell you that Google, Facebook and Amazon absolutely blew up this town with their AVERAGE salaries.
The tech boom predates the push for higher wages for everyone else, correct. The influx of higher-paid workers into the core of the city also drove (and continues to drive) much of the real estate problem (though that’s overall a bigger issue than Seattle).
someone’s spent too much time in a padded cube.
I’ve lived here 60 years and you my friend. Should look in the mirror.
What are you talking about – I have lived in Seattle for 20+ years of which 15 years were spent on Capitol Hill. I am just trying to provide perspective with actual numbers, sorry if your only counterpoint is to insult.
My “counterpoint” was perspective. And advice.
Definitely going to miss Jilted SIren. I never had a bad time there, and the bar patrons and staff were always willing to have a conversation.
Always a warm and welcoming spot!
This is getting way too confusing… it’s time to dump tipping and just pay everyone at least minimum wage… then places could raise prices to what it reasonably costs to run the business without chasing away customers who would definitely feel strained at paying even more but still adding 20% at the end of the night..