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posted
08/05/11 06:25 AM
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updated
08/05/11 11:38 AM
As city preps for streetcar construction, Broadway extension push gears up - UPDATED
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Tom Fucoloro
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Pine/Broadway
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No left turn from Broadway to Pine? Bad move! I'll miss the tree lined median on Broadway near SCCC but I can understand there's no room for it.
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Comment by
MikeH
9 months ago
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RE: Pine/Broadway
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Personally I would have to disagree. I've always thought Pike and Pine should remain a one-way couplet for their lengths, rather then just downtown. This design will help funnel eastbound traffic to Pike (or Union or Madison) and westbound traffic on Pine. Makes sense, and should fix that Pine/Broadway intersection which has always been horrible for pedestrians.
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Comment by
Zef Wagner
9 months ago
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That bike lane is really going to be awesome. It will create a very comfortable connection for Capitol Hill, SU students, Hospital workers, and Yesler Terrace.
I do hope they at least extend the bikeway to 10th if not all the way to Roanoke. |
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Comment by
JoshMahar
9 months ago
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11th & Federal will pretty much do that right now.
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Comment by
Andrew Taylor
9 months ago
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11th doesn't continue through Volunteer Park and Federal is an absolutely horrific street for biking. It is quite possibly the most pothole-filled street in Seattle. If they fix that up and put some good signage and easy transitions to Broadway then it could work.
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Comment by
JoshMahar
9 months ago
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RE: Beautiful Bike Lane!
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Seattle designated 11th and Federal as a bike route years ago, but never repaved it or did any of the normal traffic-calming measures. Compare that to Portland where designated bike boulevards are really comfortable to ride on. I think Seattle is not willing to spend the money on doing it right, so this is an opportunity to use streetcar construction to provide a better bike route.
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Comment by
Zef Wagner
9 months ago
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Elderly risks? Really?
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Curbs, right on red, broken sidewalks, folding signs everywhere, drain grates, electrified utility covers, slippery utility covers, tree roots, bike racks, sign posts, slippery paint lines, etc. etc. etc.
But a track in the ground?! Now we've gone too far! |
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Comment by
SeattleSeven
9 months ago
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RE: Elderly risks? Really?
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I'm only in my 20's, but I've walked with a cane for four years now. I have slipped on everything you've just pretty much mentioned over the years, and broken my nose a fair amount of times. Luckily, I'm apparently quite resilient. I do have to say, though that I've caught my crutch in rails before, and it's scary. You do learn to be vigilant about it. As well as wet crosswalk lines, and storm grates. I can remember many times on drinking trips to Portland my friends, and I playfully making jokes whenever I would get caught in the MAX rails. However, I can see this being a problem for the elderly, but I really can't think of a way around it. I'm really in support of all the new transit projects, and can't wait for them to be completed. However, I don't think just mentioning this possible issue is "Fear-mongering". It's good to keep people aware of these things. If it really is a problem, maybe just a sign that says "Watch your step. Ground Rails"
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Comment by
DWest
9 months ago
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RE: Elderly risks? Really?
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It's called flange filler. European countries do it. Why SDOT can't or won't is still outside my understanding.
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Comment by
JohnS
9 months ago
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Aloha!
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What is old is new again... I recently took the Pike/Pine historical tour. There was a streetcar line that ran down Broadway and led to the first development on Capitol Hill. Of course, that streetcar didn't stop halfway down Broadway and neither should this one! Roy is an acceptable ending, but the idea of a turnaround at Aloha is still preferable. We need to push for Sound Transit to see our neighborhood as a whole entity and not just a connection point so that they can make up for a bad decision regarding the First Hill light rail station being cut from the final plans.
Thank you Richard Conlin and Sally Clark for actually voicing support for a complete streetcar route on First Hill AND Broadway. |
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Comment by
seattlekps
9 months ago
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RE: Aloha!
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I still don't understand why there is only one station between downtown and Husky Stadium, whether the second or third station would be on First Hill or someplace else. Yeah, this is a bit off topic, but I just had to vent.
Capitol Hill/First Hill has the densest population of any place in the entire Pacific Northwest, and the residents already embrace mass transit. Just don't understand why there isn't a station near 15th and/or 19th and/or 24th/Montlake since a tunnel runs along this entire route. Ok, I'm done. |
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Comment by
Erik
9 months ago
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RE: Aloha!
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Originally the line was going to be under Broadway and Portage Bay, and there was a station planned at First Hill and another proposed at Broadway & Roy (but dropped). That alignment was too risky at the Ship Canal. Later they found another alignment going diagonally to Montlake, and dropped the First Hill station which was too far south for the new alignment to reach, but they did not revisit the question of adding stations. I never heard any suggestions for stations at 15th and 23rd until after the ST2 vote. I also wonder how expensive they'd be, since they'd have to be deep underground, and where the money for them would have come from.
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Comment by
MikeO
9 months ago
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RE: Aloha!
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A station at 15th or 19th would be incredibly expensive. It would have to be deeper than the station at Broadway, and the properties that would need to be condemned would be extensive, both in cost and neighborhood impact. It would be a very costly and challenging project, and wouldn't add a large number of additional riders for the cost. North Capitol Hill is dense, but the not as dense as Broadway or First Hill. Anyone who rides the 10 or 43 regularly will notice that a large percentage of riders exit at Broadway.
Link operates as a mostly grade-separated main line, with higher speeds and fewer stops than a streetcar service, so building a large station at Broadway, with supporting surface rail and bus trolly service (10, 43, 12) is an acceptable compromise. The thing now is to continue to push Metro for upgrades to the trolly system, both in equipment and increased frequency, extending the streetcar to Aloha (though Boston St would be great, someday), and to support increased residential density around the Broadway station and along current trolly and streetcar lines. All of these things are doable, given the large in the neighborhood, and can be implemented over time, as budgets and voter decisions permit. |
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Comment by
SousDesNuages
9 months ago
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The cars
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The illustrations seem to show Škoda 14T cars. We have about 160 of these in Prague. They are ugly and out of date. The newer 15T model is way ahead of its predecessor in design, looks and performance.
I suggest that a deputation of transport people visit Prague and check out the 15T cars we have running. Go and ride them and be impressed. |
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Comment by
Charles Billette
9 months ago
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RE: The cars
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We currently use Inekon's 12 Trio cars for the S.L.U.T. so I would assume this line would use the same.
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Comment by
Randopop
9 months ago
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RE: The cars
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Be thankful that this line is not using federal funding and thus does not have to abide by Buy America provisions. The Portland Streetcar extension is federally funded so they have been forced to use a new American streetcar manufacturer. They have already run into delays because they don't know how to build the propulsion system correctly.
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Comment by
Zef Wagner
9 months ago
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RE: The cars
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Whatever cars we use here will be customized to some degree. This streetcar will run off-wire (i.e. on battery) for about half a mile at each end, due to the complex trolley overhead. I wouldn't read anything into the streetcar models they've chosen for these conceptual mock-ups.
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Comment by
Wombat
9 months ago
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Green Paint
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I've heard from many-a-biker that the green paint used to make the bike lanes is extremely slick, especially in wet weather. I wonder if anyone has thought of this and if there is a solution anywhere. I would hate to see bikes skidding into traffic due to the new "safety" measures.
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Comment by
arcanepsyche
9 months ago
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RE: Green Paint
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You would have to be an idiot to come into a bike box at a speed (with a red light) to make this possible.
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Comment by
Biker
9 months ago
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I've not noticed that to be true on the boxes that have been painted. Maybe when they're new?
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Comment by
gerwitz
9 months ago
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Broadway Streetcar.
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We finally took a cue form Europe and will put a 2 way bike lane on one side of the street. I am sure it will be a full car lane wide(like we need that) Hopefully it will be about 5 feet wide. The Street car project is NOT NEEDED. I am sure it will wipe out any parking on Broadway!!! Also having the sidewalk push out into the THRU LANE for buses and new streetcar loading is STUPID! Who thought this up? Did Seattle Transportation Engineers really have any idea of TRAFFIC or MAIN AUTOMOBILE STREETS?
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Comment by
JimmyLSeattle
9 months ago
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RE: Broadway Streetcar.
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Um, you know that Broadway is only one lane in each direction for most of its length, right? That means it is a minor arterial, not a major one. 23rd is the north-south speedway, not Broadway. Traffic should move slowly down a pedestrian-oriented street, and cars should get stuck behind transit, not the other way around.
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Comment by
Zef Wagner
9 months ago
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How can a mere resident hope to influence the project to extend to Aloha?
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Comment by
gerwitz
9 months ago
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contact the Capitol Hill Community Council at chcc.officers@gmail.com and let them know you want to join the Streetcar Campaign group
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Comment by
blancheatthedubois
9 months ago
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What is the benefit if busses do this already?
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What is the point? Busses go up and down Broadway all day. These tracks have no right-of-way so I don't see any benefit?
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Comment by
Asher
9 months ago
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RE: What is the benefit if busses do this already?
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Well, first of all the only bus that goes all the way down Broadway to Jackson is the 9x, and that only runs every 30-60 minutes on weekdays only. This streetcar will operate 7 days a week at 10-15 minute frequency.
Second, while a bus could have been put in instead (there was a whole study on this), Sound Transit decided that a streetcar would provide a better link between light rail stations and would get better ridership. They put it to a vote and the people voted for it in 2008. |
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Comment by
Zef Wagner
9 months ago
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Complete the street car to Aloha
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Metro has made noise about possible elimination / cuts to the 14N. Completing the new street car to its logical end near Aloha / north end of Broadway would ameliorate for me some of the pain of losing service on the 14N.
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Comment by
Jack
9 months ago
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RE: Complete the street car to Aloha
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Good point. It would be more important than ever to have a good link from the north end of Broadway to the light rail station.
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Comment by
Zef Wagner
9 months ago
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RE: Complete the street car to Aloha
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Looping the streetcar at Aloha (like the #9 bus does now) would also allow the streetcar to terminate close to Volunteer Park ... and it would still work if in the future the line was extended further north to connect to an extended SLUT line to the UW (could replace the 49 (or most of it))
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Comment by
Gordon Werner
9 months ago
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changes at Boren/Terrace/Broadway
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couple of things I noticed a while back ... Terrace St. will disappear between Boren and Broadway ... for more park (which I like) ... also noticed one of the only switches is located there ...
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Comment by
Gordon Werner
9 months ago
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cost of extending the streetcar line north?
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Any one have any idea what it would cost to extend the line and have it loop around Aloha St?
If the cost is a known value it might make it easier to raise the money ... |
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Comment by
Gordon Werner
9 months ago
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No parking on Broadway?
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Looks like the new lanes on Broadway are going with two-way travel lane for bikes and no parking for cars. So having an every-ten minute-streetcar is extremely usefull. Traffic may go away by half if you don't have a parking spot to go to on Broadway.
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Comment by
Randi
9 months ago
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